InterviewCarol Lee

Published on Wednesday, 23 January, 2013 | Comments

static

Interview Helen Parlor

Wednesday, 30 January, 2013

Rosie Kay

Sunday, 20 January, 2013

the new space is corrupt junk

©2014 Article19 all rights reserved

+44 131 208 1845 - [email protected]

Last year Carol Lee, a costume designer based in Leeds, took it upon herself to set about Arts Council England after it became clear that the funding monoliths dealings with regards to a project entitled "Artists Taking The Lead" were less than honourable.

In December 2012 Arts Council England issued a report exonerating itself completely of any wrong doing, just like catching a small child with their hand in the cookie jar.

Article19: Can you give us a brief summary of the issue you raised with Arts Council England.

Carol Lee: I make costumes, not for a living, but because I enjoy making costumes, I've done it for about 30 years, one of the local artists that I make [costumes] for, they are usually independent artists, there was a chance remark in March of last year about the Leeds Canvas bid.

I just have a knack for smelling out dodgy situations, and out of interest really, a selfish interest, I started looking up a few things. That's how I got started and I started uncovering all sorts of things which to me didn't seem right.

A couple of months later I posted some details on Facebook and Twitter [I got a call] from Arts Professional, from Liz Hill the Editor, and with her I went into it in more detail. I provided her with all the information and she had [their] legal team check it all out.

We then followed it through until its natural end which was the internal review [carried out by Arts Council England] that was released in December [2012].

Article19: What was the crux of problem?

CL: The main thing was that the Arts Council England did not stick to their own guidelines. [They] have rules and regulations and they broke them repeatedly, everything else was secondary.

Article19: Can you give us an example?

CL: The Artists Taking The Lead Award (the project funded by ACE) stated in their rules that an a council or a university could not apply. They broke that rule.

The second rule was that members of the judging panel had to declare all of their associations [with applicants] but they didn't do that either.

Those were the two main problems that I picked up on. The Arts Council sort of turned it around, trying to get a sympathy vote [if you like} by saying that I was attacking individuals for their involvement which wasn't the case at all.

If the people on these judging committees did not stick to the rules then they [ACE] have to accept that and the criticism of their actions.

Article19: Did you go straight to AP with your information?

In Conclusion

"Arts Council England is innocent of all allegations of malpractice in relation to its Artists Taking the Lead (ATTL) programme in Yorkshire, according to the report of an internal review led by its Chief Operating Officer Althea Efunshile.

Accusations by a member of the public that the successful bidder for the £0.5m Cultural Olympiad fund, the Leeds Canvas consortium, should have been deemed ineligible at the outset have been rejected, as have claims that ACE failed to follow its own guidelines, especially in relation to the undeclared links that members of the judging panel had to the successful bid.

The report is based on published documents, together with six interviews by Efunshile, five of them with Yorkshire ATTL panel members and one a former member of Leeds City Council.

Whilst acknowledging that the expression of interest for the programme was drafted jointly by the Artistic Director of Yorkshire Dance and the City Council's Head of Arts and Events on behalf of the Leeds Canvas consortium group, Efunshile says: "I do not agree that this is evidence that the bid was not artist-led or that the bid was in fact Leeds City Council led."

[ Source: Arts Professional ]

CL: No, I did it on my own, I approached Tom Riordan CEO of Leeds City Council because most of the information came from the minutes of meetings of his council's task groups.

I told him about this situation and he asked one of his members of staff to look into it. So, they looked into it and he gave me their answers which were all as I expected, they denied everything.

I did the same thing with Nick Ahad from the Yorkshire Post. I gave him the same information and said "look, this is what I think". He wouldn't touch it with a barge pole, he refused to look at anything. The only comment he made was a review of the actual internal review by ACE which was in December.

I [also] contacted Culture Vulture's, Emma Bearman, she said that it was none of her business.

So, basically I had no help whatsoever. people were not interested in the facts. Slowly though I started to get support from individuals. Eventually I had about 80 people, via Facebook, who actually wanted answers from the Arts Council.

I went on the [live chat] with Liz Forgan (ACE's soon to be replaced Chairwoman) and I asked a question about this issue.

She sort of sidelined the question. She said if there was a case to answer then they would answer to it. At that point I emailed her the details and she came back and basically said "you don't know what you're talking about".

For the second [live] chat, ACE actually took off all the details that related to my question [from the transcript]. They put it back on again because Arts Professional noticed so they called them [to ask why].

So, from the time the conversation took place to the report that comes out afterwards they deleted it all and then they they put it all back again because their legal team realised that couldn't delete something that had actually happened.

I also started getting anonymous people calling me and telling me "you're on the right track".

Local artists though, and I can't blame them, were not really interested in standing up to the Arts Council because they have the power to not fund them at all. It's hard enough as it is for artists.

So all of the information that I obtained, and through people at the Arts Council, was confidential, so I know what I'm talking about, I proved my case. The internal review that came out said, sort of, "no, there is nothing to answer but yes you are right about this and right about that" and the other information that I supplied to them they just ignored completely. It was a bit of whitewash but nothing that I didn't expect.

Furthermore

We asked Nick Ahad, the journalist with the Yorkshire Post who was contacted by Carol Lee about the story, to comment for this interview.

He declined to answer any questions about why he chose not follow up on the information provided to him.

A document on Arts Council England's website lists Mr Ahad's biography on a list entitled "Artistic Assessors Biographies". The funding monolith confirmed that Mr Ahad is currently one of their Artistic Assessors.

Article19: How do you react to Liz Forgan demanding that the government be open and transparent after you experience dealing with this issue?

CL: I don't take anything that any spokesperson from the Arts Council says seriously because if they cannot do the basic things, like following their own guidelines then it's all just words.

Article19: Have you ever applied for funding from ACE?

CL: No and I have no intention of ever doing so, that's why I can talk the way I do. I realise that there is pressure.

I can see that [people] might feel reluctant on a personal level to criticise the Arts Council. I look at it from a point of view that [they] shouldn't have to feel like that. [People] should be able to apply for funding from the Arts Council and know that they can stick to the guidelines and that there would be no comeback if [they have] an opinion on a particular matter that relates to the Arts Council.

I think the ACE has forgotten what they are supposed to be about, they have lost their way. They do lots of good stuff but there's a lot of stuff that they really need to look at.

Article19: You say that you expected the outcome, so why did you want to push the investigation?

CL: I think it's sort of a selfish pass time. I enjoy investigative journalism and reporting. It doesn't matter what it is, it just so happened that this was the Arts Council and it cam along and I thought, this doesn't look right.

So I've proved my case to myself. I'm quite hard on myself as far as getting evidence is concerned, if I can't prove it 100% then I leave it out. There is a lot of stuff that I didn't even mention because I couldn't actually prove it.

I was told by a person [that I won't name] exactly what the report [from Arts Council] would contain and it was almost word for word, so I knew what to expect even before it came out. I feel really sad that a public organisation like the Arts Council cannot stick to its own rules and regulations because they [actually] have really good rules and regulations but they break them all the time.

If you're an independent artist and you go exactly by the rules as stated in their guidelines, you're not going to get any funding because your not massaging the egos of the personalities that are involved in the funding body.

You have to be prepared to fawn and compliment [them] on social media.

I think that all of this is a great shame because we are losing a lot of real art because what is being funded is things that have been funded in the past. Big organisations, safe bets. Anything creative doesn't have much of chance of getting funding .

[ Arts Professional 'Olympian Struggle For Fair Play' ]
[ ACE Report Exonerates Self ]

  • kema

    Well done Carol !!

    "Article19: Have you ever applied for funding from ACE?

    CL: No and I have no intention of ever doing so, that's why I can talk the way I do. I realise that there is pressure."
    Everyone else is scared to question the Arts Council in case they don't get funding.

  • adam ashley

    Well done carol it takes a lot to stick to your guns but you did it and hopefully will help artists in the future

  • Fiddler

    Dear Carol, I have been reading your correspondence with ACE with interest (& dismay). I have been trying, unsuccessfully thus far, to secure a small amount of funding for an amateur Yorkshire orchestra. I have just received my third refusal. It appears I always fall at the final hurdle - the local panel. Having read everything associated with your requests from ACE, I am now not surprised - just very disappointed. I congratulate you on not letting your queries go unanswered & challenging those concerned to answer the difficult questions. I don't doubt they wish you would give up. Don't ! I wish there were more people like yourself willing to ask those difficult questions & to keep digging & digging . . . . . . .

  • arlington

    Well done Carol for sticking it to the Arts Council and calling them out on their cronyism. The arm's length principle gives the Arts Council carte blanche to do whatever they damn well please. The scandal of Andrea Stark's pay out shows their bloated sense of self-entitlement. I have no intention of applying for funding from the Arts Council. I have come to recognise the Arts Council logo as a kite mark of shiteness.

  • Anne-Marie Quigg

    Carol Lee's actions were courageous and UK artists should be thanking her for her probing questions about ACE's views on fair play; they are legitimate and deserve to be addressed fully. I also participated in the online fora, asking a question about a different topic, and I recall Dame Liz Forgan promising an independent inquiry if Carol Lee could produce evidence to back up her queries – which she did. That independent inquiry has not happened. My own research reveals how hard it is to speak out against someone or something that has control over your future, and the vast majority of artists are acutely aware that ACE has considerable power to significantly influence, for good or ill, their artistic careers and their financial survival. ACE needs to remember, and to demonstrate, that with power comes responsibility. On that count, we're still waiting...

  • Damian Colman

    Unless artists take some control of their industry and account of their responsibility to the broader public benefit, then they condemn themselves to a moral and social wilderness. It is one thing to be attacked for what you say, but too many times you've been attacked for having the temerity to say it - which is highly indicative of the underlying problem - that is, in the respect of Leeds Canvas, our institutions departed from serving any benefit to anyone but themselves.

blog comments powered by Disqus